Presenters: Roger L. Cauvin
& Lisa Crymes
DownLoad Slides Here
About the Webinar: RYMA's October 14th Webinar was presented by Roger Cauvin and Lisa Crymes. A recent hot topic and debate was sparked on Twitter during the recent PMV webinar "Why are there so few great product managers? A CEO's perspective", by Barbara Tallent. This webinar was a follow-on to that discussion.
A product manager's value to a company stems from an understanding of the users, buyers, competition, and problems in the market. But what makes a good product manager? The goal of this presentation is to discuss the issues and differences of opinions around domain expertise and if it's really required to be a successful product manager.
Key Ideas Explored:
- How important is prior knowledge and experience in the domain or industry?
- How important is the ability to quickly and thoroughly acquire this knowledge?"
- Can you be credible in your company or in front of customers without domain experience?
- Can to much domain experience actually dilute an objective opinion?
Background Reading: Industry Experience: How Important Is It?
Roger L. Cauvin Roger has seven years experience in strategic marketing, most recently as the principal product management consultant at Cauvin, Inc. With clients ranging from software development companies to real estate developers, Roger develops strategy by immersing himself in markets and applying established marketing principles. His strategic advice drives all aspects of product development marketing, including requirements, positioning, and messaging. Roger writes his thoughts on product management in his blog (cauvin.blogspot.com), and he is the author of two popular articles that appeared in the on-line marketing periodical, MarketingProfs.com.
He began his professional career as a software engineer in 1990, holding technical leadership positions at several companies before developing an interest in requirements and the strategic aspects of marketing.
Roger is an Austinite and lives in the heart of downtown. He received his undergraduate degree in Philosophy, along with a minor in Computer Science, from the University of Texas in 1990.
Lisa Crymes Lisa is a Director of Product Management with Emdeon. She is an experienced product management professional with extensive background in healthcare, including over 12 years of Healthcare IT experience. Lisa is an active member of Georgia's Healthcare Financial Management Association (HFMA), currently serving as the Chair for the Education Committee, and is on the Board of Directors for the Technology Association of Georgia (TAG) through the Product Management Society.
Lisa received her MBA and Bachelor of Arts in Management from Shorter College in Rome, GA. www.Emdeon.com
ValWorkman: @MikeBoudreaux If you can't participate in today's #PMV discussion feel free to contribute in the LinkedIn CoP http://bit.ly/10cnGz
evans_anna: RT @StewartRogers: RT @ValWorkman: Today's noon ET #PMV webinar http://bit.ly/1O1q2Y is a continuation of the debate on industry experience!
evans_anna: Key Strategies for Service Management Success in Today's Economic Environment http://bit.ly/IGWuX #pmv #prodmgmt
pganza: RT @ValWorkman: Today's noon ET #PMV webinar http://bit.ly/1O1q2Y is a continuation of the debate on industry experience
HakanKilic
: RT @ValWorkman: Today's noon ET #PMV webinar http://bit.ly/1O1q2Y is a continuation of the debate over how much industry exp #Prodmgmt needs
MarcJMillerPM: RT @HakanKilic @ValWorkman: noon ET #PMV webinar http://bit.ly/1O1q2Y debate over how much industry exp #Prodmgmt needs
L3N: Attending #pmv with @valworkman w/presenter @rcauvin Is Doman Expertise Critical to be a successful Product Manager? Lisa on Twitter too?
phanschke: Listening to the #PMV webinar http://bit.ly/1O1q2Y.
MikeBoudreaux: I'm attending @rcauvin discussion: "Is Prior Industry Experience Critical to be a Successful Product Manager?" http://bit.ly/1wMmOR #pmv
evans_anna: Wikipedia on PM #pmv #prodmgmt http://bit.ly/1wS7Os
BstnMelody: Listening to the #pmv discussion around necessity of prior domain experience for #prodmgmt
evans_anna: Great advice on what is needed to be a PM #pmv #prodmgmt http://bit.ly/3vAgZg
evans_anna: What is Deductive Reasoning? #pmv #prodmgmt #management http://bit.ly/B1n3b
ken_hoffman: #pmv Attending a webinar on whether domain experience is important to being a successful product manager. http://bit.ly/41noDC evans_anna: Palmer, Alaska HS student on Deductive Reasoning #pmv #prodmgmt http://bit.ly/S5MsL
evans_anna: Great interview with Aziz Muza #pmv #prodmgmt http://bit.ly/ohGfY
MATSIS: Listening to "Is Doman Expertise Critical to be a successful #prodmgmt; - Rymatech - #PMV Webinars http://bit.ly/2cMKsfevans_anna: 7 Traits of Successful PMs -Michael #pmv #prodmgmt #ceo http://bit.ly/VmAQE
jidoctor: #pmv - but, if the #prodmgmt role is about ;learning, doesn't coming from the outside often allows for grt lrning w/ no bias?
Brittanyherrera: Product Managers primary role is to understand the market & report that to others in the company #pmv #business #leadership #management
evans_anna: Link to PM best practices #pmv #prodmgmt http://bit.ly/1uIfzm
evans_anna: PM News continually updated #pmv #prodmgmt http://bit.ly/3pcsaJ
jidoctor: #pmv - w/ 20+ yrs in same industry, while knowledgeable biased to inject your own bias & may not listen? not all #prodmgmt ppl can keep out
ValWorkman: RT @jidoctor: #pmv - but, if the #prodmgmt role is about ;learning; doesn't coming from the outside often allows for grt lrning w/ no bias?
evans_anna: Diplomatic opinion on what PM is #pmv #prodmgmt http://bit.ly/3JEFUo
mack_mccoy: Am I the only one experiencing major audio problems on the #pmv domain knowledge webinar? I'll give the phone a try instead of streaming.
Brittanyherrera: As a Product Manager-proactive learning is best #pmv #leadership #business #management
jidoctor: #pmv - can't you learn the industry basics from all from research & w/i company, and apply >#prodmgmt skills to bring "new" learning?
evans_anna: Good insight on what function PMs perform and importance to CO #pmv #prodmgmt http://bit.ly/42qOuN
BstnMelody: #pmv the most ignored aspect of #prodmgmt is the strategic end - where you learn by getting out & talking to your market
evans_anna: Bitpipe's definition of PM #pmv #prodmgmt http://bit.ly/36LVQ4
L3N: "Most neglected parts of product management are the strategic parts" @rcauvin #pmv #prodmgmt
MikeBoudreaux: Learning types: accretion, transmission, acquisition, emergence illustrated in Knowing Knowledge - Google Books http://bit.ly/3LHffM #PMV
evans_anna: PM jobs - quietly #pmv #prodmgmt http://bit.ly/13GPyj
phanschke: I'm experiencing audio problems on the #PMV domain knowledge webinar. Using the Internet for audio ... not the phone.
MarcJMillerPM: #pmv - #prodmgmt who who relies on past experience is creating product designed for the past. Current cust research is more important
jidoctor: wrote a blog on this topic before CEO #pmv webinar...http://bit.ly/fQo9J...this is a long running "battle" in #prodmgmt and #hr discussions
evans_anna: SVPG blog articles on PM #pmv #prodmgmt http://bit.ly/21Xhgl
mack_mccoy: @phanschke I switched to the phone and it's working perfectly now. #PMV
evans_anna: the PM's toolkit #pmv #prodmgmt http://bit.ly/zxXlj
BstnMelody: #pmv - Is @rcauvin saying prior industry experience is or isn't necessary?
MarcJMillerPM: #pmv - #prodmgmt who who relies on past experience as cust is creating product made for the past. Current cust research is more important
bhaskarsinha: #pmv Lisa's voice is clear
evans_anna: Teams' exp. is more important than individual experience? #pmv #prodmgmt
haigtweets: RT @evans_anna: PM jobs - quietly >#pmv #prodmgmt http://bit.ly/13GPyj #pcs09
jharmer: #pmv Another version of that pyramid Roger was discussing http://bit.ly/5IIV8 evans_anna: How to be good PM see comments #pmv #prodmgmt http://bit.ly/184lTX
jidoctor: #pmv #prodmgmt - agree w/ @rcauvin that a good balance of skills & domain is ideal, but also very rare. so, where place priority?
leminade: #pmv I can't agree more that job descriptions want industry experience for #prodmgmt and yet fail to list "inquisitive" requirements
evans_anna: PM's handbook #pmv #prodmgmt http://bit.ly/bKwAQ
evans_anna: Blogs and more on PM #pmv #prodmgmt http://bit.ly/15kPwV
jidoctor: #pmv - different types of ppl gravitate towards dev role than #prodmgmt...for a reason! not everyone can facilitate and/or LISTEN
mack_mccoy: Good post! RT @jidoctor: wrote http://bit.ly/fQo9J on this topic before #pmv webinar...this is a long running "battle" in #prodmgmt #hr
BstnMelody: @jidoctor I place priority on skills set. #pmv I still argue industry info, lingo, etc can be learned
evans_anna: Expert Product Management: Advanced Techniques paperback #pmv #prodmgmt http://bit.ly/37GMZx
BstnMelody: #pmv Love comparison of #prodmgmt to therapist. We draw out information from customer.....
jidoctor: #pmv - imho, easier to teach a #prodmgmt pro about the industry then to teach a dev-focused how to listen w/o designing the sol'n
evans_anna: Improve PM? #pmv #prodmgmthttp://bit.ly/dvAKI
BstnMelody: #pmv you want to be context agnostic when interviewing customer. Totally agree! Don't even mention your product!!!
evans_anna: RT @Brittanyherrera: Product Managers primary role is to understand the market report that to others in the company #pmv #prodmgmt
MarcJMillerPM: #pmv Agreed, industry experience is important; puts PM in same context as customer. However what does PM do when they want to chg industry?
phanschke: #PMV Communication ... listening, extracting, probing, etc. ... are a key skill set for PM's - regardless of industry.
BstnMelody: #pmv Understand problems of customer, rather than ask them what they want (they want a faster horse).
phanschke: @BstnMelody implication is that PM's have to be great listeners. #PMV
jidoctor: #pmv RT @BstnMelody: Understand probs of customer, rather than ask what they want (they want a faster horse). [JD] my point exactly!
luiscerda: #pmv If you can't sell yourself in a interview, are you a good prodmg?
BstnMelody: #pmv Signing off. Every1 agrees u need 2 understand market. Prior industry def helps, but not hearing why necess. Its not. Can be learned.
MikeBoudreaux: W/o domain experience, PM likely asks inquisitive questions about mkt needs rather than making assumptions based on past experience. #pmv
MarcJMillerPM: @luiscerda #pmv a good salesman can sell themselves. A good PM listens. A PM delivering product customer doesn't want EOLs the product
evans_anna: 7 Traits of Successful PMs -Michael #pmv #prodmgmt http://bit.ly/VmAQE (expand)
Brittanyherrera: If a process is in place 4 being a successful PM,the process should guide the student 2 B successful. #pmv #leadership #business #management
MikeBoudreaux: Good point @rcauvin - Mix of industry experience and strong product management skills in organization is an ideal situation. >#pmv
L3N: Agree 100% RT @MikeBoudreaux: Good point @rcauvin - Mix of industry experience & strong #prodmgm skills in organization ideal #pmv
phanschke: @MikeBoudreaux absolutely right. #PMV
phanschke: Signing off the #PMV webinar now.
evans_anna: What is Deductive Reasoning? #pmv #prodmgmt #management http://bit.ly/B1n3b
evans_anna: Critical steps in conceptualizing and conducting multilevel research. #pmv #prodmgmt http://bit.ly/391THi
Brittanyherrera: Product Management vs. Product Marketing: Management is inbound, Marketing is outbound #pmv #leadership #business #management
L3N: Is it me, or is the audio constantly cutting out of #pmv ?
luiscerda: Agree! #PMV Product positioning is a strategic activity that should sit with #prodmgmt.
MarcJMillerPM: @L3N audio is fine for me #pmv
MarcJMillerPM: RT @Brittanyherrera: Product Management vs. Product Marketing: Management inbound, Marketing outbound #pmv #prodmgmt #business #management
L3N: RT @Brittanyherrera: Product Management vs. Product Marketing: #prodmgmt is inbound, Marketing is outbound #pmv
jidoctor: >#pmv- hiring w/ domain exp=hiring from competitors? might not be the best move unless comp is leader in mkt! why do u want their mistakes?
StewartRogers: @L3N been fine for me #pmv
Brittanyherrera: Webinar notes: If you only rely on experience you are not likely to have a different product #pmv #management #business #leadership
leminade: #pmv hiring a #prodmgmt with domain experience could be hiring from competitor but it could also be hiring from customer.
MarcJMillerPM: #pmv http://bit.ly/13NUfJ - how to become a product manager #prodmgmt
lisacrymes: Thanks for the great audience twitter and chat feedback on #pmv webinar
Ken: So, how does leadership skills: consensus building, persuasiveness, etc. rank compared to domain experience? Especially if a PM has a product owner from the technical side to work with?
Kristin: Without experience/domain expertise, how does a Product Manager know how to prioritize what needs to get done first? What's most important to the customers?
Mike: How about the fresh view from an industry outsider? Focus on new ideas and needs rather than status quo.
Elizabeth: Why are you stereotyping those with existing experience as being non-inquisitive or inable to learn? I believe you said it was "very rare".
Scott: What do you see as the differentiators between product management and marketing management
Sally: Any suggestions for minimizing the risk of "industry expert" product managers from making too many assumptions and not questioning/learning from customers/prospects?
Bhaskar: When I interview a customer and try to get market requirements, they often talk about the solution. We need to get back to the problem and work out the various solution.
casey: My experience is that turnover is high in the PM world because employers have high hopes for PMs to come in and "change their business" but completely fail to properly align resources and personnel to facilitate this scueess. i just think its harder and harder to build 10+ years of industry experience because most good product managers don't want to stay in purely tactical roles where we are ineffective because most good PMs i know are aggressive in our careers and typical type A people.
Tom: If you have a good product manager, it is easier for them to gain domain knowledge, than a domain expert trying to learn how to become a product manager
Mike: How about learning market needs with a blank slate - will ask more inquisitive questions rather than making assumptions based on past experience.
Tom: IF a hiring manager can not find a PM with Domain AND PM expertise, should I hire an expert PM or and Domain expert?
Tom: If you are hiring a PM with Domain experience, ... you are hiring from your competitor
Paul: I have found that Product Managers are having to be innovative. to come up with ideas for products that are unique, ideally. As we said with the echo chamber, I think it would be difficult to latch on to alternative, "outside the box" ideas.
Erwin: Lisa, if you are responsible for a global product, you're badly advised to trust in your NAMER industry experience. You're better off to focus as a facilitator. The health care system in Europe is differently organized and I have seen many products failing because people thought that a US product fits European standards. BTW: Great discussion!
Paul: Is it easier for the process oriented person to pick up domain knowledge rather than the other way around?
Sally: I've been in Health Care Product Management for 20 years. My 2 cents: people with industry experience are vulnerable in over-valueing it and good product managers are often passed by if they lack the industry experience. I personally think it is easier to educate a PM with the right skills on an industry than to try to turn any SME from an industry into a good PM. Understanding what the right core skill sets of PM is too often misunderstood.
Mike: What about the flip side, where product manager thinks of themselves as industry expert first and foremost and don't think of product management as a professional domain?
Mike: Many PM's who fall into product management need those same kinds of learning to figure out how to be a good PM.
Paul: Peter's argument is covering the in-life part of Product Managemnt. There is a whole area defined as New Product Development. You need outside the box information. How can you do NPD without industry experience?
Mohamed: Product management should not be engineer new products/features but should be focused on developing products that solve customer problems. Please comment.